Episcopal Round Table Invitational 2011

Louisiana Running Milesplit Discussion

  • Zach Fitzgerald
    User
    3200guy
    8:00…………One mile fun run…(3 rd mile of 3 mile course)

    8:20…………..Junior Varsity Boys & Girls – 2/3 Miles (Unlimited: Boys and Girls Together-No Team Scoring. Coaches are responsible for timing their own competitors in the JV race)

    9:00 ………… Girls Varsity 3 Miler (Team Scoring)* (10 entries only)

    9:40…………. Boys Varsity 3 Miler (Team Scoring)*(10 entries only)

    10:10………....Girls Jr. High 2 Miler (9th and under – Team Scoring) * (15 entries only)

    10:40………….Boys Jr. High 2 Miler (9th and under – Team Scoring)* (15 entries only)

    11:10………….Awards Presentation
  • User
    SlowerAndSlower
    boys varsity
    st paul
    ehs
    and in a tie broken by the 6th place-
    chs (st cyr didnt finish)
    sta

    girls varsity
    sja
    dominican
    menard

    how could ehs beat sta?
    previous posters said they didnt have talent of sta and too much talent had left.
    hmmm
  • Sean Swanner
    User
    s_swanner Edited
    Episcopal is going to be very difficult for anyone besides St. Paul's and Catholic to beat. Their 5th runner the past two weeks has a PB of 16:23 and is substantially ahead of where he was at this time last year.

    The temperature was about 5 degrees cooler than last week for the varsity boys, but I noticed it was a little bit more humid.
  • Sean Swanner
    User
    s_swanner
    geauxgreat
    @SlowerAndSlower

    What happened to St. Cyr? Did Stafford run? I know Primeaux wasn't going to run.


    @geauxgreat

    Stafford won in 15:29. Johnson of Episcopal was next in 15:32 and N. Fitzpatrick of Jesuit was 3rd in the same time.

    St. Cyr was in 2nd at the 1.5 and looked pretty good, but dropped back in between there and 2 miles. I am not sure when he dropped out. It's pretty impressive that Catholic got 3rd without 3 of their top 5--St. Cyr, Primeaux, and Ross.
  • User
    anythinggoes
    SlowerAndSlower
    boys varsity
    st paul
    ehs
    and in a tie broken by the 6th place-
    chs (st cyr didnt finish)
    sta

    girls varsity
    sja
    dominican
    menard

    how could ehs beat sta?
    previous posters said they didnt have talent of sta and too much talent had left.
    hmmm


    @SlowerAndSlower
    Are you sure about EHS in 2nd? It looked like STA beat them fairly easily. Where are the results posted?
  • User
    anythinggoes
    geauxgreat
    @anythinggoes

    Results are now posted.


    @geauxgreat
    WOW!! Episcopal top 5 avg- 16:29.6 STA top avg- 16:29.0. I still say it will be a nail-biter at the state 2A meet. When you take out the non-2A schools, it's too close to call!!
  • User
    anythinggoes
    JesRover
    I thought sta was suppose to completely destroy everyone?


    @JesRover
    I'm not sure who you are asking, but my original post 9 wks ago was a prediction which was:
    "2A- Episcopal and St. Thomas Aquinas (too close to call)"

    After this CrusaderDenny opined:
    "Anyone claiming that Episcopal is not the strong favorite in the team race is engaging in what J.P. Sartre called "bad faith"."

    Then s_swanner wrote:
    "The point is that I've been reading for 12 years now that Episcopal might not win. Only once has the state meet been close. There have been a couple of years where we only had one returner who had ever broken 17:20 for 3 miles and still won. The group of kids returning this year is one of the stronger groups. They have shown me nothing so far that indicates they shouldn't be the favorites as of right now."

    Then PeteTownshend wrote:
    "You think this is the first time a team has come into the season with some pipe dream of beating Episcopal?"

    Anybody thinking STA would "destroy" Episcopal is crazy. I would not be shocked if both Episcopal and STA put 5 runners in the top 12 at the state meet. Take out all schools in other classes at the Round Table meet and STA beats Episcopal 28pts to 27 pts. Again, my opinion is "too close to call."
  • User
    thespecs
    @anythinggoes

    There is no chance of STA and Episcopal both placing 5 in the top 12. Rice and Soto plus 5 from each team already puts you at 12. Koenck beat Wheat and Brocato the last time they faced off. Zack Levesque from Lakeside is another runner who will surprise a lot of people this year. Hank Patrick from University has run 10:40 for 3200m. Isidore Newman has a couple of guys with 17:00 ability. Steven Roland from Runnels is another strong runner who I can see breaking up Episcopal and STA's top 5 in November.
  • Coach
    sjvgators
    @thespecs
    Matt was recently diagnosed with mono so not sure what he will end up doing this season now. It's too bad because he was running incredible workouts. Steven Roland moved out of state.
  • User
    anythinggoes
    thespecs
    @anythinggoes

    There is no chance of STA and Episcopal both placing 5 in the top 12. Rice and Soto plus 5 from each team already puts you at 12. Koenck beat Wheat and Brocato the last time they faced off. Zack Levesque from Lakeside is another runner who will surprise a lot of people this year. Hank Patrick from University has run 10:40 for 3200m. Isidore Newman has a couple of guys with 17:00 ability. Steven Roland from Runnels is another strong runner who I can see breaking up Episcopal and STA's top 5 in November.


    @thespecs
    I thought Anacocco moved back to Class B. Patrick ran 11:20's for 2 mile. Folse from Newman might be a wild card. Otherwise it could happen
  • User
    PeteTownshend
    @anythinggoes

    Surely you don't think what happened today could possibly bode well for STA's chances against Episcopal? The only thing we saw today is that Episcopal is ALREADY ahed of STA when even the most pro-Episcopal speculators thought EHS wouldn't have their act together this year. The fact that they beat CHS, Brother Martin, and Jesuit with McGaugh only running a 17 flat is frightening. This is their strongest team since Swanner and co left. I am very impressed by STA(best 2A team of the last decade outside of Episcopal) but the streak isn't ending this year.
  • User
    anythinggoes
    PeteTownshend
    @anythinggoes

    Surely you don't think what happened today could possibly bode well for STA's chances against Episcopal? The only thing we saw today is that Episcopal is ALREADY ahed of STA when even the most pro-Episcopal speculators thought EHS wouldn't have their act together this year. The fact that they beat CHS, Brother Martin, and Jesuit with McGaugh only running a 17 flat is frightening. This is their strongest team since Swanner and co left. I am very impressed by STA(best 2A team of the last decade outside of Episcopal) but the streak isn't ending this year.


    @PeteTownshend
    What bodes well for STA is the improvement of sprinter/hurdler, Craig Rock. He went from a 19:28 5k on 9-3-11 to a 17:24 today. He may be the fastest guy on the team. If he continues to improve his endurance, he could be 3rd or 4th on the team within a few weeks.
  • Zach Fitzgerald
    User
    3200guy Edited
    PeteTownshend
    @anythinggoes

    Surely you don't think what happened today could possibly bode well for STA's chances against Episcopal? The only thing we saw today is that Episcopal is ALREADY ahed of STA when even the most pro-Episcopal speculators thought EHS wouldn't have their act together this year. The fact that they beat CHS, Brother Martin, and Jesuit with McGaugh only running a 17 flat is frightening. This is their strongest team since Swanner and co left. I am very impressed by STA(best 2A team of the last decade outside of Episcopal) but the streak isn't ending this year.


    @PeteTownshend

    Excuse me for a bit while I post something dopey, but I still say we should let the runners decide the race for themselves rather than say one team or the other "has the state title in the bag" already. Last time I checked we still have more than 8 weeks until the state meet. Of course I'm speculating like I said we shouldn't, but whichever team wins, I don't think it'll be a runaway victory.

    Also, I think it's kind of naive to just assume that because "Episcopal is already ahead of STA" that STA has no way of making up any ground on Episcopal.

    Just for the heck of it, if the meet was scored as a dual meet, STA would have won 27-28. Plus, I don't think anyone mentioned the 6 or 7 runners on each team, but they're more important than some people realize. All it takes is one guy to get injured or have an off day or just drop out, and all of a sudden it's up to one or possibly both of the "pushers" to come through. Anyway, STA's 6 and 7 guys were 44th and 54th vs. Episcopal's 6 and 7 guys who were 79th and 81st.

    I hate to be cliche, but it (the 2A state championship) ain't over 'til the fat lady sings, and she ain't gonna sing until November 15.
  • User
    thespecs
    Excising dual meet results from a large invitational does not mean very much. The race dynamics are totally different and it is much easier to hide from your opponent in an invitational versus a small meet like a dual or AA state.

    For example, Episcopal's 2-4 did not break into STA's top 5 runners until well after a mile and a half. McGaugh did not pass STA's 5th until ~2.5 and ended up finishing within a second of their 4th.

    A small meet where the scoring runners from both teams are in the top 20 after 4 or 5 minutes would play out totally differently than today's race. Today's race does not tell us much at all. We already knew both teams were fairly evenly matched.
  • Coach
    rungabby
    3200guy
    PeteTownshend@anythinggoes

    Surely you don't think what happened today could possibly bode well for STA's chances against Episcopal? The only thing we saw today is that Episcopal is ALREADY ahed of STA when even the most pro-Episcopal speculators thought EHS wouldn't have their act together this year. The fact that they beat CHS, Brother Martin, and Jesuit with McGaugh only running a 17 flat is frightening. This is their strongest team since Swanner and co left. I am very impressed by STA(best 2A team of the last decade outside of Episcopal) but the streak isn't ending this year.

    @PeteTownshend

    Excuse me for a bit while I post something dopey, but I still say we should let the runners decide the race for themselves rather than say one team or the other "has the state title in the bag" already. Last time I checked we still have more than 8 weeks until the state meet. Of course I'm speculating like I said we shouldn't, but whichever team wins, I don't think it'll be a runaway victory.

    Also, I think it's kind of naive to just assume that because "Episcopal is already ahead of STA" that STA has no way of making up any ground on Episcopal.

    Just for the heck of it, if the meet was scored as a dual meet, STA would have won 27-28. Plus, I don't think anyone mentioned the 6 or 7 runners on each team, but they're more important then some people realize. All it takes is one guy to get injured or have an off day or just drop out, and all of a sudden it's up to one or possibly both of the "pushers" to come through. Anyway, STA's 6 and 7 guys were 44th and 54th vs. Episcopal's 6 and 7 guys who were 79th and 81st.

    I hate to be cliche, but it (the 2A state championship) ain't over 'til the fat lady sings, and she ain't gonna sing until November 15.


    @3200guy

    Excellent post 3200...sure seems they are coming out of the woodwork against STA after today's meet. I love it. As you posted, STA would have won heads up in a dual meet, had a slightly faster average time, and their #6 and #7 were far ahead of Episcopal's, yet they have two chances-slim and none Also note that this was STA's first time on "a real course" while EHS has run there already this season, yet still would have won 27-28 in a dual.

    Still, once again, challenging anyone to show where EHS was said to have no talent, but on the flip-side, sure does look like many (EHS graduates I assume) write off STA as having none. Funny, isn't it. Take note also that apparently EHS is the only team in the entire state that has runners improve over the course of the season.
  • Ernie McGee
    User
    CrusaderDenny
    @rungabby

    I think the controversy about "talent" comes from anythinggoes's post on another thread. He said: "The truth is, they are not as phusically (sic) talented as they have been in the past" referring to Episcopal.

    Then, 3200m times were provided. When averaged (mean), the 3200m times indicate that the incoming 3200m bests of Episcopal's runners this year are slightly better than they were in 2010.

    Again, trying to compare a large race with 30 kids under 17:00 to a dual meet or a race in November that might, on a good day, have half as many kids under 17 is kind of pointless. Who knows how either team would race in a different situation.

    I was standing at the two mile mark today for a while and jotted down team scores. At two miles, through 4 runners, STA led Episcopal by a score of 47-64. Through 4 runners at the finish, Episcopal had gained a 53-35 advantage. This doesn't mean anything, I just thought it was an interesting fact. St. Paul's dominated the race from 1 mile on. If St. Cyr had finished as he normally does, Catholic would have easily placed 2nd. With the addition of Primeaux and Ross they are not to be counted out.

    Comparisons of a few teams who raced at Highland both this week and last:
    St. Paul's averaged 18 seconds better for their top 5 runners. Catholic averaged 8 seconds worse without their #2 and 3 from last week. Of their top 7 from last week, they improved 15 sec, 31 sec, 13 sec, 34 sec, and 37 sec for a mean of 26 seconds. Episcopal's top 5 improved by 30 sec a man. St. Michael's top 5 was 32 seconds better than last week.

    In contrast, only one of STA's top 6 from Thursday the 8th bettered their time. Strike it up to course familiarity, weather conditions, or whatever you like. These are facts and they are indisputable.
  • Ernie McGee
    User
    CrusaderDenny
    And, by the way, Zach Capello is one of the most mature freshmen racers I have ever seen. The kid from Trafton, who is known to be quite good, went out at sub 2:30 for the half mile. Capello let him go and ran his own race. That takes both guts and brains. Capello ended up taking it to him, hard, in the 2nd mile. I have no doubt that he would have broken 16 in the varsity race. This kid has 15:40 written all over him in November. Congrats to his dad on a fine coaching job.